Observer-Reporter forum

OndinitaAKALibchit

The Dems really need to grow a pair and start acting like they are the majority in Congress!!

http://www.newsweek.com/id/218193

Cylinsier · Master Joined: 29 Sep 2008 Posts: 13229 Location: Oh shi-

The thing is, if the Dems would just step up and be like, "we're doing it whether you like it or not" to the congressional GOP, the voters would probably be thrilled. Its like they can't read public opinion polls. They see slipping ratings and think, "uh oh, we need to play to the conservatives a bit." Those ratings are slipping because you're playing to the conservatives!
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OndinitaAKALibchit · Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2009 1:37 pm Post subject:

Cylinsier · Master Joined: 29 Sep 2008 Posts: 13229 Location: Oh shi-

If they would just do so, they'd see support basically equal to what they saw in terms of votes that got them all elected in the first place. The people complaining that they are too liberal all voted against them to begin with. The slipping numbers are among the independents, who thought they were giving progressives a turn and are probably now mistaking this boring moderate style of legislation for the progressive style they voted for. Its like the Dems, even thought they won, have convinced themselves they won't win again unless they have lots of Republicans voting for them.
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SSSS · Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2009 1:47 pm Post subject:

Sorry but I am snickering all the way here. After seeing nancy and dirty harry talking about having ALL the power and we can pass ANYTHING WE WANT !!!, Spector moving "to the winning team" etc.
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OndinitaAKALibchit · Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2009 1:57 pm Post subject:

Nancy, Harry, etc are a bunch of kitties with a "P"!! Wink

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"If by a 'Liberal' they mean someone who looks ahead and not behind, someone who welcomes new ideas without rigid reactions, someone who cares about the welfare of the people — their health, their housing, their schools, their jobs, their civil rights and their civil liberties ... if that is what they mean by a 'Liberal,' then I’m proud to say I’m a 'Liberal.'" ~ Senator John F. Kennedy 9/14/1960

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Cylinsier · Master Joined: 29 Sep 2008 Posts: 13229 Location: Oh shi-

Yeah, the power is useless if you don't use it.
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SSSS · Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2009 2:44 pm Post subject:

...or maybe it only existed in their minds?
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Brant · Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2009 2:48 pm Post subject:

Anything short of a public option is an epic failure, and I would be inclined to vote against Democrats just on that basis alone. What we should do is outlaw political parties and forbid politicians from claiming to be members of one. That way, they'd have to actually outline what they think about issues without just pointing to the party they belong to. Also, they wouldn't have to live in fear of rebuke if they went against one element of the party platform.
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The priests of the different religious sects dread the advance of science as witches do the approach of daylight.

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OndinitaAKALibchit · Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2009 2:53 pm Post subject:

I agree, Brant. The other solution would be to have multiple parties instead of the two party system we have now...
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"If by a 'Liberal' they mean someone who looks ahead and not behind, someone who welcomes new ideas without rigid reactions, someone who cares about the welfare of the people — their health, their housing, their schools, their jobs, their civil rights and their civil liberties ... if that is what they mean by a 'Liberal,' then I’m proud to say I’m a 'Liberal.'" ~ Senator John F. Kennedy 9/14/1960

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Cylinsier · Master Joined: 29 Sep 2008 Posts: 13229 Location: Oh shi-

I think it existed in the idea that they would all put their differences aside to repay the voters for their confidence. Instead, the blue dogs split off in an attempt to please fiscal conservatives. Result: conservatives are pissed because all they can do is distract from the sidelines, moderates are pissed because the liberals are too liberal, and liberals are pissed because they thought they had slam dunks on everything and instead their congressmen are sitting on their own heads. So nobody wins. If the dems would just say "eff it" and do some things, at least somebody wins. The conservative base isn't going to be pleased by anything for the next four years, especially if its a success. So congress needs to at least let somebody win.
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Brant · Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2009 2:59 pm Post subject:

The problem is, the Democrats can't do anything in the Senate without the Blue Dogs (read as Democrats in Name Only), who are mortally afraid that they'll be booted from their jobs if they vote for the public option. I really don't know how a public servant can sleep at night when they choose self-preservation over what they know to be the right thing for the people.
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The priests of the different religious sects dread the advance of science as witches do the approach of daylight.

- Thomas Jefferson

Cylinsier · Master Joined: 29 Sep 2008 Posts: 13229 Location: Oh shi-

Here's my problem with no political parties:

You take away the ability to accrue party funding for campaigns, meaning the richest people will always be the ones running in the forefront. You also take away the ability to superficially identify political leaning from party affiliation meaning that everyone has to read up on every candidate closely and carefully to find the one that they want. That would be fine if we lived in a country where everyone was educated, but since we don't, the person who is best at convincing stupid people he is a good guy would always win (like a Beck). And you will never have a political mandate again as everyone will splinter off and vote for different people; your election winner will have something like 13% of the vote. Unless you do successive runoffs in which case you'll have leaders start campaigning for their next election before they're sworn in for their first because it will take so long. And ultimately, groups will create and join de facto parties because they will perceive all these shortcomings, find loopholes around anti-party regulation, and return to running on joint platforms as it will be the only way to secure proper exposure. One group will do it, others will follow to stay competitive. As humans are naturally dualistic, all sub groups will eventually identify as liberal or conservative, with a minority again refusing to affiliate or identifying as moderate and coming to represent the weak but existent spectrum of third parties. Basically, our current system is unavoidable. The US began as a no-party system by the design of the founding fathers. It didn't take long for the parties to develop. The amount of regulation to make it work and keep it working would be insane, in my opinion.
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Cylinsier · Master Joined: 29 Sep 2008 Posts: 13229 Location: Oh shi-

SSSS · Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2009 3:33 pm Post subject:

Cy-only the richest people are running now! Or the candidates they endorse.
I think the answer is term limits. If a member of Congress were not so worried about getting re-elected they might actually pass some meaningful legislation.
I also like the idea of no political parties but we all know that just will not happen.
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