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Amphikalein
Journeyman
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
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Location: Corrales, NM
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 Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:01 pm Post subject: |
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On the proposed Employee Free Choice Act legislation - i encounter a great deal of confusion and outright misinformation on this legislation. Just for clarity, here's some reliable info from politifact.com:
| Quote: | Here's how union elections work now:
Union organizers try to get employees in a particular business or unit of a business to sign cards indicating they want the union to represent them in negotiations with the employer. The employer is not permitted to see the cards before they are turned in to the National Labor Relations Board — or often even after that — or engage in any other kind of surveillance to try to discern which employees are union adherents and which are not.
If more than 30 percent of the employees sign, the union can ask the National Labor Relations Board to conduct an election. If more than 50 percent sign, the employer must either accept the union or ask the board for an election.
Most employers ask for an election. It takes place a few weeks later at the employer's place of business. It's a secret-ballot election and is run by the National Labor Relations Board. If a majority votes for the union, the union wins.
Here's what would happen under the Employee Free Choice Act:
Just like before, if unions got more than 30 percent of the employees to sign cards, they could ask for a secret-ballot election. But if they got more than 50 percent, the union would win automatically. The employer would no longer have the right to insist on a secret-ballot election and would have to negotiate with the union.
"De-certification" elections, where the employees vote on whether to cease being represented by their union, are currently secret-ballot elections, and would continue to be under the Employee Free Choice Act.
As a practical matter, secret-ballot elections would be far less frequent if the Employee Free Choice Act were passed. But they would still take place under certain circumstances: during de-certification contests, or on the occasions where unions won the support of more than 30 percent but less than 50 percent of the employees (but unions don't generally ask for elections unless they have the support of more than half).
There would also continue to be secret-ballot elections in instances where a majority of employees say they want one. That is, where more than 50 percent of the employees sign cards requesting a vote on unionization rather than cards saying they want a union to represent them. |
Honestly, i don't see how that substantially advances an ability for organizers to "jam Unions up our azzes." What am i missing? 
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"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter." ~Martin Luther King Jr.
"May we, in our dealings with all the peoples of the earth, ever speak the truth and serve justice." ~Dwight D. Eisenhower
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SSSS
Journeyman
Joined: 13 Oct 2008
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Location: Wash PA
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:06 pm Post subject: |
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Conversely, where I work a union was trying to get one department to join. They basically were telling the employees if they did not sign the cards there was no chance of a vote to get the union. Thus, they had 77 percent cards signed but the actual vote went something like 79 percent AGAINST joining the union.
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Amphikalein
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Joined: 10 Oct 2008
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Location: Corrales, NM
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:09 pm Post subject: |
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77% of people in that particular department for, but 79% of all company employees against? Am i understanding correctly, or am i way off base?
_________________
"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter." ~Martin Luther King Jr.
"May we, in our dealings with all the peoples of the earth, ever speak the truth and serve justice." ~Dwight D. Eisenhower
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busdriver
Journeyman
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 3497
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:12 pm Post subject: |
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| ellipses wrote: | On Nov 11, I will be at the end of my projects list for this year and can go back to playing on the internet all day...
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Honest to god, you really do do something? Let me give you some advice, don't do a really really good job on this project or they will give you more responsibility and the next thing you know you will have chit coming at you from all directions.
E, can you look at this project the hot babe you ogle at all day screwed up?
E, what do you think of this?
e, you did such a great job on that Nov. 11 project, I'd like you to do this one, ok?
E, can you stay over an hour or so to finish this for me? |
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ellipses
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Joined: 29 Sep 2008
Posts: 9218
Location: WashPa!
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:15 pm Post subject: |
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No for real, I DO do work... Our year's worth of work is crammed into October-April, though... So, basically... I eat, drink, and sleep market research projects from now until it gets warm again 
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busdriver
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Joined: 16 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:45 pm Post subject: |
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| ellipses wrote: | | No for real, I DO do work... Our year's worth of work is crammed into October-April, though... So, basically... I eat, drink, and sleep market research projects from now until it gets warm again |
I believe you, just don't want to see you taken advantage of. |
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ellipses
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Location: WashPa!
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:47 pm Post subject: |
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You sound like my wife Seriously... Everyone here goes through periods where it seems like we have a completely unreasonable work load... but for the most part, we are rewarded for it.
But hey, it's not like I'm digging ditches... so I have a few sleepless nights... it could be worse
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ellipses
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:48 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for your concern
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Cylinsier
Master
Joined: 29 Sep 2008
Posts: 13229
Location: Oh shi-
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:50 pm Post subject: |
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I have concern for you.
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ellipses
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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Shut up
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SSSS
Journeyman
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 1:00 pm Post subject: |
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no amph-79 percent of the employees in that one department. The union had cards signed by 77 percent but the vote was 79 percent NO to the union.
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busdriver
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Joined: 16 Mar 2009
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 1:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Amphikalein wrote: |
There would also continue to be secret-ballot elections in instances where a majority of employees say they want one. That is, where more than 50 percent of the employees sign cards requesting a vote on unionization rather than cards saying they want a union to represent them. |
Honestly, i don't see how that substantially advances an ability for organizers to "jam Unions up our azzes." What am i missing? [/quote]
Have you ever seen or worked where an organizing effort (handing out cards) was being conducted? |
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Amphikalein
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Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Posts: 3177
Location: Corrales, NM
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 1:32 pm Post subject: |
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Well, that's certainly skeevy. i don't think anyone can argue that there isn't some corruption in various unions, just like no one can really argue that there isn't some corruption in government. It's up to regular union members, just like it's up to us regular US citizens, to get involved and root it out whenever it takes over (or tries to.)
_________________
"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter." ~Martin Luther King Jr.
"May we, in our dealings with all the peoples of the earth, ever speak the truth and serve justice." ~Dwight D. Eisenhower
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Amphikalein
Journeyman
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Posts: 3177
Location: Corrales, NM
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 1:34 pm Post subject: |
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Actually, no i haven't BD. That's why i'm asking. i've mostly worked on the management side of companies, and i've had numerous dealings with managers who've worked with unionized companies.
_________________
"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter." ~Martin Luther King Jr.
"May we, in our dealings with all the peoples of the earth, ever speak the truth and serve justice." ~Dwight D. Eisenhower
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Brant
Admin
Joined: 29 Sep 2008
Posts: 5277
Location: Hopewell Township
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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The card check bill is a horrible piece of legislation. What's wrong with the current secret-ballot process. Not a damn thing. If you want to see arm-twisting and coercion and veiled threats, just wait until a union gets the chance to secure the right to represent workers just by getting enough of them to sign a piece of paper. Nobody's ever been able to tell me what's wrong with the current secret-ballot election process. If workers want a union, they have the opportunity to vote for one.
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